Rusty Bowtie
General Category => General Discussion - Intros => Topic started by: munch on August 03, 2016, 01:33:27 PM
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I have just recently install a FiTech EFI on my engine and have to use one of the two ports on the manifold for the temp sensor it used and the other houses the electric fan sensor. I need a spot to install the temp gauge sensor and don't want to use the below the #1 spark plug because on its proximity to the header. I have heard of locating it in the lower radiator, but am not setup for that.
There is a location at the top of the water pump but don't know how accurate it would be. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
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How does the passenger side head between 6 and 8 look?
Are you using (3) sending units? One for the fan on/off, one for dash temp gauge and one for the EFI (open/closed loop) sensor?
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I would think the outlet on the water pump should give you a good reading.
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MUNCH if you used the one on the manifold for your water temp gauage then just split it and use the one for the fan off of that How much more accurate than that can you get vette59jdwl
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MUNCH if you used the one on the manifold for your water temp gauge then just split it and use the one for the fan off of that How much more accurate than that can you get vette59jdwl
Vette,
I ask SPAL the following and got this reply:
I have installed EFI on my engine and the sensor takes up one of the two installation points on the manifold. I don't want to install the temp sensor below the # one spark plug because of the proximity of the header. It there a way to share the SPAL fan sensor?
Thanks
Hi Michael,
Sorry the Spal temp switch can only be used for the fan relay as it is only a grounding temp switch. You need a temp sensor for the gauges.
But you are saying that the temp sensor should be compatible with the SPAL fan?
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MUNCH if you used the one on the manifold for your water temp gauage then just split it and use the one for the fan off of that How much more accurate than that can you get vette59jdwl
Vette,
I did ask and here is the reply:
No unfortunately the temp sensor will not work to control the fan relays. The temperature switch for the fan relay and a temperature sensor for the gauge are two totally different types of devices which makes them incompatible with each other. The temp switch is an on/off device where the temp sensor is a variable resistance output (thermistor) to tell the gauge different temperatures based on that resistance value.
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How does the passenger side head between 6 and 8 look?
Are you using (3) sending units? One for the fan on/off, one for dash temp gauge and one for the EFI (open/closed loop) sensor?
Ed,
I will look at the passenger side.
That is correct, I am using 3 units as described.
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How does the passenger side head between 6 and 8 look?
Are you using (3) sending units? One for the fan on/off, one for dash temp gauge and one for the EFI (open/closed loop) sensor?
Ed,
I will look at the passenger side.
That is correct, I am using 3 units as described.
I'm surprised the EFI system doesn't use the temp sending to control the temp gauge and fan on/off relay via the ECM like an OEM GM EFI does. That's how I control my EFI conversions.
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How does the passenger side head between 6 and 8 look?
Are you using (3) sending units? One for the fan on/off, one for dash temp gauge and one for the EFI (open/closed loop) sensor?
Ed,
I'm surprised the EFI system doesn't use the temp sending to control the temp gauge and fan on/off relay via the ECM like an OEM GM EFI does. That's how I control my EFI conversions.
I will look at the passenger side.
That is correct, I am using 3 units as described.
It has a fan control lead, I just don't understand how it works.
http://fitechefi.com/files/30001.30002Instructionsm12.9.15.pdf
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Looking at the charts you can eliminate your current on/off fan sensor and install the kit supplied temp sensor. The yellow/black temp sensor wire goes to the ECM on the throttle body.
When the engine reaches a set temperature the engine goes to closed loop and the O2 sensor and ECM take over managing the fuel delivery. The yellow wire coming from the connector goes to the fan relay to supply ground to circuit 85 on the relay.
When the engine reaches a fan pre-set temp, the ECM sends a ground signal (yellow wire) to circuit 85 on the relay. The relay gets it's fused ignition power via circuit 86. As the relay is grounded via 85 the circuit closes powering the electric fan to cool the engine (just like an OEM ECM).
You need to use a relay to power the fan and maybe you are already using one to power your current fan? Is your fan 1 or 2 speed?
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Looking at the charts you can eliminate your current on/off fan sensor and install the kit supplied temp sensor. The yellow/black temp sensor wire goes to the ECM on the throttle body.
When the engine reaches a set temperature the engine goes to closed loop and the O2 sensor and ECM take over managing the fuel delivery. The yellow wire coming from the connector goes to the fan relay to supply ground to circuit 85 on the relay.
When the engine reaches a fan pre-set temp, the ECM sends a ground signal (yellow wire) to circuit 85 on the relay. The relay gets it's fused ignition power via circuit 86. As the relay is grounded via 85 the circuit closes powering the electric fan to cool the engine (just like an OEM ECM).
You need to use a relay to power the fan and maybe you are already using one to power your current fan? Is your fan 1 or 2 speed?
Thanks Ed, the tech I got didn't seem to understand what I was asking. I have a single SPAL like the diagram below and I asked where to connect the yellow wire. Would the yellow wire attach to the grey sending unit wire on the SPAL diagram?
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Can't read the diagrams but you are probably using the top drawing with single speed fan, so disregard the bottom drawing it's for a (2) speed fan setup.
From the pdf link you listed earlier..the yellow wire is the "signal ground" from the ECM to the "fan relay".
If you already have a "working electric fan setup" using a block sending sensor (on/off only) that activates the fan AND IF THE FAN IS ALREADY USING A RELAY you just need to remove the wire from the current fan on/off sensor and attach the yellow wire from your EFI connector to it. The ECM will then send the ground signal to the relay (#85) instead of the old fan on/off sensor doing it. (Old fan on/off sensor is no longer needed)
Look at the attached drawing again Fan #1 (85) is the yellow wire you are talking about...
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Can't read the diagrams but you are probably using the top drawing with single speed fan, so disregard the bottom drawing it's for a (2) speed fan setup.
From the pdf link you listed earlier..the yellow wire is the "signal ground" from the ECM to the "fan relay".
If you already have a "working electric fan setup" using a block sending sensor (on/off only) that activates the fan AND IF THE FAN IS ALREADY USING A RELAY you just need to remove the wire from the current fan on/off sensor and attach the yellow wire from your EFI connector to it. The ECM will then send the ground signal to the relay (#85) instead of the old fan on/off sensor doing it. (Old fan on/off sensor is no longer needed)
Look at the attached drawing again Fan #1 (85) is the yellow wire you are talking about...
Yes that would be the grey wire going to the sensor. This link has a drawing that shows it better. It was the instruction to connect the yellow wire to a ground relay terminal that was messing me up.
http://www.hotrodhotline.com/md/html/fan_control.php
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I just called the company...your EFI setup can be programed to turn the fan on at any temp you want. You don't need the sending unit in the SPAL kit and looking at the diagrams...you really only needed a relay with whip.
Option 1: If you already have an electric fan using a on/off sensor and relay..just remove the sensor from the block and connect that wire to the yellow wire on the 6 pin connector..that's it. You need to install the EFI kit temp sensor and connect it via the blk & yellow wire connector.
Option 2: If you are connecting the electric for the first time, install the supplied EFI kit temp sending unit in the block, the black yellow connector then connects to the ECM on the throttle body.
Now take the yellow wire from the 6 pin connector & connect that yellow wire to the grey one in the SPAL kit that's it (don't use the SPAL sending unit). That pictured optional fan bypass is handy but not required.
In the end..you only need (2) sending units: The one supplied with the EFI kit and the (existing) one used for the dash temperature gauge.
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I just called the company...your EFI setup can be programed to turn the fan on at any temp you want. You don't need the sending unit in the SPAL kit and looking at the diagrams...you really only needed a relay with whip.
Option 1: If you already have an electric fan using a on/off sensor and relay..just remove the sensor and connect the wire to the yellow wire on the 6 pin connector..that's it. You need to install the EFI temp sensor and connect it via the blk & yellow wire connector.
Option 2: If you are connecting the electric for the first time, install the supplied EFI kit temp sending unit in the block, the black yellow connector then connects to the ECM on the throttle body.
Now take the yellow wire from the 6 pin connector & connect that yellow wire to the grey one in the SPAL kit that's it (don't use the SPAL sending unit. That pictured optional fan bypass is handy but not required.
In the end..you only need (2) sending units: The one supplied with the EFI kit and the (existing) one used for the dash temperature gauge.
Ed,
I feel like a dummy, I either confused the tech I called or he didn't know, most probably me. What you did was above and beyond and I cannot thank you enough. Thanks for taking the time out to help. I owe you...
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No problem glad to help...attached a picture of how I installed a return fuel line into the existing 37 Chevy sending unit. You need high pressure line from the pump to throttle body but not on the return line.
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No problem glad to help...attached a picture of how I installed a return fuel line into the existing 37 Chevy sending unit. You need high pressure line from the pump to throttle body but not on the return line.
Thanks Ed, I will definitely let you know when I get it running. Right now it is on the life because I am working out the 4 link. I figure this would be a good time since there is no fuel in the system. I drained the system when I put the Aeromotive Phantom in tank fuel pump. I might as well finish.