Rusty Bowtie
Miscellaneous => Outdoors Area: Hunting, Fishing, Firearms, Camping, Hobbies, Videos etc => Topic started by: Rattiac on September 05, 2021, 12:57:51 PM
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Earlier this year I placed an order for a marine Dickinson solid fuel wood stove for our trailer.
7w X 7deep X 14"tall. Pretty small but up to 8,000 btu's. 🔥
(Tried propane last winter but wayyy too much condensation inside even with windows cracked open.)
Done plenty of reading on the piping subject. Lots of anal talk of "no bends" in the exhaust but I found one guy that had no problems .
Mounting it to the back door that we dont open seemed like the bestest, safest spot and plus we can watch the fire at night.
Here's the short of it.
1st.) I made an exhaust hole using a 4" deck plate for a boat.
Took out insulation about an inch around inside and put a strip of sheetmetal galvanized inside for protection.
Since the plate is removable, I ordered a 4" screen so its a vent during the summer.
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Next the piping. It calls for 4 to 6ft of pipe.
I ordered the 22" single wall stainless pipe they recommend.
Going through the door I needed to fill the 4" hole.
I found pellet stove pipe thats double-wall. Turns out single wall would go into double wall but not vise-versa.
So I got a "cleanout-T" and elbow with another 24" section of straight pipe. Thats 5ft of pipe total
I'll use exhaust wrap to fill in any gap and more protection.
The double wall should keep the pipe hotter inside to create a better draft and protect the door.
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Next is the heat shield/ mount. It'll be spaced out 1/2" for a air gap. The stove will also be spaced 1/2" as well.
I used some diamond plate left over from the teardrop.
Screwed into the beams in the door but had to use 2 "jack-nuts" where it went into the wood.
Also made a "wall thimble" where the pipe goes through the door. More protection like a house.
Next is just assembly and drilling holes for the stove to mount which will be removable and attached at camp.
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Looking forward to see how it works this winter.
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Arches NP would be awesome in the winter, says the wife. ;D
Im game.
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Arches is a beautiful spot. Definitely a favorite.
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The carshow today was cancelled, so I tinkered with the trailer a bit.
Mocking up the piping and the stove. I was able to mark the holes to drill.
Had our little mobile swamp cooler in the trailer going while working on the stove was nice. 😎
Pic soon.
Outside i'll need something to secure the pipe so wind dosent blow it over. Im thinking of something like a fire exstinguisher strap. Quick on/off.
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Never knew anyone made a unit that small, perfect for your application. Looks like you did some research, and are a nice clean job.
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Mock up pic. Even enough room on top for our coffee perculator .
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Never knew anyone made a unit that small, perfect for your application. Looks like you did some research, and are a nice clean job.
Thanks.
I was thinking the Cubic mini stove (cub) was the smallest and then I found this.
I couldnt figure out how to secure the outside pipe and make it quickly removable . Walked away for awhile.
Then it hit me. What if I used a fire extinguisher metal strap. 💡
So I bought a mount and removed the metal strap.
Using a conduit clamp for that to slide through gave me the distance to space it out a bit cause of the gutter.
All mounted up. It holds the pipe nice and tight.
I notched the stoves upper bracket so I could just slide on the upper part and have it hang from the bolts and install the lowers easily.
Im ready for fire 🔥.
Come on winter 😉🥶🌨
Pics soon.
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I'm glad you are ready for winter but I'd like some Fall first. Looks like we may get some next week. :)
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1.) Notch in bracket
2.) Fire extinguisher strap, used some O-rings to keep handle closed
3.) Inside
4.) Exhaust pipe
The only thing left is put a small plastic block under the door to help suppport it.
Now that this is done, I can get to other projects before winter hits.
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Nice, It will make things cozy! 8)
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That really looks good. Maybe I missed in a prior post, but did you try it out yet?
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Still has the protective wrapping on it. Hopefully in a few weeks. I'll probably do a video on its first fire up.
My boss gave me a huge bag of pellets to burn. Filled two 5 gallon buckets and I have some wood from a cherry tree that I trimmed up also.
Nice to know if theres an emergency , like last years earthquake 😬 . We can use the trailer.
Hopefully that dosent happen. Just prepping.
I guess im an official "prepper" now. 😉
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You're not a pepper until you have some MREs and cut shooting slots in the trailer. ::)
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I got bored and gave it a test (outside) just to see how hot everything gets.
It calls for 10 pieces of 1x1x5 wood at the max.
I put (5) 1/2" pieces in. Seemed plenty, the eco fan started spinning minutes after starting the fire.
Took temps of the pipe going up. The double wall did get hot, so I'll use some exhaust wrap where it goes through the door.
After the fire went out, the fan kept going for another 30 mins. Shows how much heat this gives off.
Last pic is the temp of the stove top. Looks like it'll do coffee ☕. 😎
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That is great, it will be nice to be warm and have a comforting fire to watch this winter. Will it be effected by fire regulations in places you camp in the tender dry west? We haven't had a smoke free day in months.
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Im pretty sure if im using this, there's snow on the ground.
All the campgrounds in the mountains usually shut down except for remote camping around here.
RV parks, I have a lil electric heater I can use but I avoid those , unless just passing through.
One thing I'll be on the lookout for is when there's wind and avoiding a back draft if I have the wrong window open or wind changes direction and smoke comes inside.
My first official test will be in the backyard and experiment with the sidewinds we get.
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Looks like a nice little unit. It'll be interesting to see how warm it keeps your trailer.
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I'm really interested in seeing you use it and what kind of burn you get. How often you have to feed it and how you will learn what sizes and shapes of wood work best for you. Can you use pellets? It is a neat looking little heater and the way you have designed it so it doesn't always have to be in place.
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I can use pellets but I'll have to put a mesh screen on the bottom or some type of stainless cup with holes in it.
Pic 1. Is the fuels I can use and amounts. Even coal.
Pic 2. We went for a drive today and scouted a campsite I've been looking at. Has nice view overlooking the lake, also has power. ⚡😎
View of the campground circled in red which happens to be open year round. Might have to try out ice fishing this winter.
Did some fishing before heading home.
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It looks like there will be no such thing a scrap woo around your place anymore. I like the charcoal idea. That would be a lot of heat per bag. I hate the smell of coal but it makes a lot of heat. Is it easy to add fuel without making a mess? Small heaters in small places can be a very nice thing.
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Looks like a nice spot to camp. Winter wind might come whipping across that lake, good to have that heater ;)
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The pellet ideal would be cleaner than charcoal less ashes to deal with.
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Looking at someone's video, they used a stainless steel cup with holes drilled in it to hold the pellets. Since my opening is 4-1/4" .
I was able to find a cup under that width.
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The stainless cup arrived today and it fits inside. Perfect size. I think I'll try a 1/2 cup first when I do test it.
Also grabbed some exhaust wrap and heat shield tape.
It's been raining here and dropped into the 5o's temps, I'm so tempted to try it out.
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I'm so tempted to try it out.
"lead us not into temptation" My son and I are tearing down a building for his new shop and need a few more days of outside weather.
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A couple of my son's friends showed up today and the building is down, loaded, and hauled except for 6 22' pieces that we will hopefully move tomorrow so let 'er rip! Get cold & use your heater all you want. ;D
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Time to start winterizing the house. Turned the furnace on and now getting the swamp cooler drained and covered.
Yesterday I played with the exhaust wrap, mocked up the elbow. Kinda a pita to assemble that part now since I have to wrap it.
Probably another test to see if that works here soon. Added pics above for the pellet cup. I removed the lid.
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A couple of inches of snow today. We lucked out with the building! I think my garden is gone. We'll have two cold nights then it is supposed to warm up again. I have ti set up the heater in the shop for the dogs & get all the hoses drained. Test away on your heater.
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Nice heater you got Rattiac! With the insulation you put in...that should keep you very warm.
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I needed to get out of the house for a minute, so I did another test (outside) to see how the exhaust wrap did and threw some pellets in. Filled the cup about 1/4 of the way.
Exhaust wrap did well. I could put my hand on the pipe while it was going.
Couldn't get an accurate reading for some reason when pointed at the wrap. Readings all over the place except for the metal sections.
The pellets were hard to get started but that 1/4 cupfull lasted 40 minutes.
Also used the heat tape (good to 400°) around the hole at the opening for more fire protection.
I think im ready for a installed test soon.
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Looks warm and cozy. Could you build an insulated cuff that stayed in the hole in the door that the pipe slipped into? Originally my stove pipe went through a big terra-cotta pipe through the roof.
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Im looking into that. Something a bit more quickly to slide in, maybe a modified starter shield.
The exhaust wrap works but to assemble the two pieces and wrap it is a pain.
That cup for the pellets is the perfect size. Goes around the pipe and fits in the hole.
I may order another to make a shield.
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Could this stuff help? Maybe fill the space between the pipe & cup?
https://www.amazon.com/Lynn-Manufacturing-Kaowool-Insulation-Fireproof/dp/B07ZQPC43B/ref=pd_lpo_1?pd_rd_i=B07ZQPC43B&psc=1 (https://www.amazon.com/Lynn-Manufacturing-Kaowool-Insulation-Fireproof/dp/B07ZQPC43B/ref=pd_lpo_1?pd_rd_i=B07ZQPC43B&psc=1)
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We threw away a electric blanket recently and was thinking of going all (Burt Munroe) and cut it up for a heat shield.
During break I went over to autozoo and grabbed a DEI starter heat shield.
I think this will work, much easier to attach with the velcro already sewn on.
We'll see this weekend. Need to go fishing 🎣.
Pic of the exhaust wrap/through the door test fit.
Probably gonna ditch the wrap and do the starter shield.
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I'm sure you have researched this way more than me. I know you will find the right combo for you. We'll know more in the spring. ::)
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Starter shield.
Took it to work to sew the edge I cut down. Luckily my boss had some flame resistant thread. 8)
While trying to put it on after assembly was a pain. So I put the sleeve in first, then pushed in the two pieces and installed the screw. This was much easier.
I'm good with this. Going camping.
I saw they planted Kokani Salmon at this lake. 🎣
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Looks like you have it. Somehow when you said starter heat shield I was thinking of the sheet metal ones. Good luck with the fishing!
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Back from camping. 8)
Friday arrived at camp at noon. It was warm, almost no jacket weather but windy. Then it died down before the sunset. Since we had a fire that night, we tried the electric 1300/1500w heater. I was surprised how good it did . It has a thermostat and had it on near 70° temp all night.
The next night we tested the wood stove. Ran it for about an hour (70°) inside. The starter shield did well. Still hot to the touch but didn't melt the deck plate . On the outside was better due to the lower temps.
Readings from the pipes were .
Bottom 212°
Top 100°
Elbow 95°
Shield 80°
Nothing burned or melted in the door so I'd say it was a success but there's room for improvement in the future.
No fish this trip not even a bite. The truck did well over Parleys canyon I-80 though. That's a serious climb here.
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Looks warm and toasty :)
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Two heat sources are bearer than one! The fire looks very nice and cozy. I think your whole rig is really cool.
Raining here all day. My son just said he has had 2.5" in Reno. That is a lot for this area. I went down the road this afternoon and cleaned out the water diversions to keep water running off the road. When I came back this evening the road was fine. It's a steep 2 miles and can wash out fast.
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What fuel source did you use in the stove? Did you try the pellets?
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I'm sure your install is right on...maybe a detector of some type is a good idea? This story is from up in our area.
https://www.nyspnews.com/state-police-investigate-fatal-fire-in-town-tupper-lake.htm
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Yes ,Thanks for reminding me. I was gonna get a fire/Co detector before the trip. I'll be putting one in soon.
I won't be running it all night long , mainly just before bed and in the morning cause we have a nice thick winter sleeping bag and always keep the window cracked open.
We did try out the pellets one morning. About a 1/4 cup, lasted about a half hour.
We did run that lil electric heater the first night all night.
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On a deer hunting trip with an old friend many years ago he was telling tales of working on a Ranch near Austin, Nevada in the early 30s. He and his bunk mate were wintering in an old cabin on the ranch. He said you could throw a cat through the cracks in the walls. They took turns starting the morning fire in a stove they could reach from their cots using tar paper they gleaned from abandoned houses in Austin. They would light the fire and not get from under their blankets until the lids on the stove were glowing red and the frozen water in the coffee pot was boiling. I asked why they didn't tack the tar paper over the cracks. He look puzzled and shrugged and just said "cowboys" ;D
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Haha,ha ;D good stuff.
Speaking of hunting.
While we were leaving the lake with the hunters, down the road we saw a heard of deer on private property and near our camp the deer went into the state park to avoid the hunters.
Woke up to the sound of shotguns both mornings.
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Deer can read or at least recognize private property & state/national park sighs. They also have some understanding of seasons. :)
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Yesterday I loaded up the truck and went camping. Kinda spontaneous. Needed to do some fishing before everything froze.
Nice campground with power and you can actually drive your truck onto the beach.
Decided to just use the wood stove for heat. At first I couldn't keep it lit but finally stayed lit.
Ran it for about 3hrs and got it pretty hot using small stips of wood and 1/2 cup of pellets.
I was surprised though at how much heat im losing.
Started too late to get the fire going. It was about 30° when I fired it up.
Slept good with our winter bag in. Woke up to 19° outside and thick fog this morning . 30° inside the trailer. Fired up the stove and made breakfast then went fishing.
I feel it could have done better. I think im losing heat through the roof vent. So I ordered a insulated piece to block that off.
Maybe I'll also insulate the windows as well.
Also when I disassembled the pipes I noticed the deck plate had some small burns/melt inside of it .
I saw they made these in stainless. Should be on order soon.
Once those 2 things are taken care of, It'll be ready for another test.
The truck did great through the Nephi area. Has a few hills and it's always windy. Usually slows me down in the jeep but it kept at 65mph no problem.
Boy that exhaust gets loud above 3,000rpms though. Im OK with that. 😎
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Working the bugs out. Like all wood stoves you probably lose a lot of heat out the pipe. A damper might help. I can not believe how much heat goes out the pipe on my "modern efficient" gas wood stove lookalikes.
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Wonder if you could fabricate a chimney pipe with small expansion tank above the heater so the exhaust (heat) is allowed to radiate inside the camper before exiting? Kinda like those 55 gallon kits..exhaust enters on one end, heats the upper barrel, then exits on the other end after the heat radiates?
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Nice. I'll be adding a damper soon.
I've been seeing these at home depot all summer and now that I need one, out of stock. Ordered online, sent to store.
Lots of debate on the subject I see. Manual damper vs. barometric damper, etc.
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Back in the hippy/homesteader days of the 1960s there was The Whole Earth Catalog. It was full of goods and "helpful" information for the "back to the earthers" Sorta' the grandparents of the "Burners" from the Burning Man farce. Any way The catalog had lots of information on wood heat. Ashley stoves were the best. They were basically a double walled sheet metal stove with a bimetal front damper for regulation. I still use one I rebuilt in the early 70s to heat my shop sometimes. It is top load only. Once the fire is started you can actually add green wood to the top of the stack. The controller draws outside (the stove) air from near the top and directs it to the bottom of the fire box. My newer Vermont Castings stoves while very pretty did not heat as well & they were much dirtier to operate. A couple of my friends had barrel stoves one was a double. I think Northers tool sell kits. You supply the barrels. My better Ashley has is top & front load. All of the control mechanism is on the front door. One of these doors would be great on a double barrel stove. None of this would fit in your trailer.
There was also a company that sold a star shaped collar made of bent steel straps that fit around the stovepipe. The theory was that the collar took heat from the pipe and radiated it into the room, more surface more heat. I don't know how well they worked and I'm sure they work better with single wall pile and a fan. In our early very little electricity days I made an adapter using this concept for my wife's hair dryer. I disconnected the heat element in an old hair dryer and just ran the fan connected to a box on the stovepipe. It worked. Heating is the most inefficient use of electricity especially if you ar running your house on a car battery. ;D Sorry for the length.
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New stainless deck plate, damper and rv vent insulator on the way.
I was even thinking of another eco fan strapped to the top of the elbow to help push warm air forward.
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Heat rises so the warmest air is above where we are in a room. It would seem that drawing the warm air down could work best but that may not be so. If you push the cool air up it will mix with the warm air and come down along the walls so there is less felt draft. This makes for a more even temp through the space.
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I think I need to flip that heat shield inside out, so the reflective part faces the pipe.
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That may be but where would the reflected heat go?
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Well the velcro is sewn inside and had a tiny burn but it should help flipping it.
The parts have arrived. Damper is installed in the pipe and going to mount the new stainless deck plate tonight.
Might get some snow this week. Time for a backyard campout this weekend.
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Just had our first snow last night and temps are supposed to plummet tonight.
Can't wait. ❄😎
I collected 2 bigger soup cans and drilled 1/8" holes all over to fill with pellets for a quick swap when needed.
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It snowed here a couple of inches yesterday. Today is sunny & cold 30 at 2:00 PM. Snow is gone from the south slopes but hanging on the north. Partly cloudy tomorrow then chance of snow the rest of the week 6" possible. Oh well, we've had the most beautiful fall weather I remember here. If this is climate change you may have to develop a wood burning cooler. I used to tell people that when I was a kid in Texas in the summer it was so hot we built bonfires to cool off. ::)
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Supposed to go up to 70 tomorrow, unseasonable for sure, but I'll take it!
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Last night I stayed in the trailer (backyard camping) and fired up the stove. Experimenting with the draft and different woods.
It low 20's and a strong wind. Opening the window only a 1/2" maybe less. Once the fire was going I closed the stove damper and the upper about a 1/4 turn. Seemed to help.
Things I burned was 1x1x5 Douglas fir and a few 1/2" pieces the same length. Also burned some cherry tree branches.
Heated up good. Jumped in the sleeping bag with a wool moving blanket over the feet also helped.
Did try using a fan at the rear facing towards the back doors pointed up. It helped the ceiling from getting hot and moved the warm air around better.
Slept great but didn't want to get out of the bag when I woke up. 40 inside.
Fired up the stove with a full can of pellets and tried making coffee with it which worked well.
One thing I noticed with the pellets is they seem to flame out quicker than I thought but smolder forever.
The stove didn't cool off for a few hours. :o
Turning the heat shield inside out (reflective side facing pipe) was the way to go and the stainless deck plate didn't even heat up.
I think im going to do 1 more test session next weekend to get the perfect camping recipe down using what I've learned last night.
Also Lowe's sells these "kindling" wood packs for $5
You can break em up by hand and work perfectly for getting the fire started.
Quick video perculating coffee this morning.
https://youtube.com/shorts/UxIlr8Q2eYo?feature=share
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Ordered another Eco fan. This one clamps to the pipe. Tried it out on the elbow facing at a 45° upwards. Seemed to work good.
Might have gotten this fire too hot 🔥. Pipe started glowing 6" above the stove. Had to choke it down and it went back to normal.
Only used about 5 pieces of wood.
Installed a CO detector too. No problem there.
https://youtube.com/shorts/fVXpS3pjUwk?feature=share
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Wonder how much heat is lost via that exhaust pipe...maybe something like this might capture some of it? (Read the reviews)
https://www.amazon.com/Stovepipe-Reclaimer-Radiator-efficient-Collars/dp/B00PE0XUBC/ref=asc_df_B00PE0XUBC/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=312131438568&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=2595807483230693406&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9005054&hvtargid=pla-567992836020&psc=1
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That is the kind of thing I was trying to describe earlier. Thanks for posting that link.
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Simple concept and a great idea!
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That concept was used on the old fuel type salamanders
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Testing it twice this weekend. I moved the clamp on eco fan to below the elbow.
This helped a ton moving the warm air forward.
It says not to go above 350° but the pipe near the top only got to 150° most of the time and 200 when it was really hot.
I think im ready for another campout soon now that I've had some tuning time.
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Lots of snow & cold wind to test it here.
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That just arrived here. Snow squall warnings ⚠️on my phone. Probably be a 1/2" in the morning. 😉
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We got 8" in the last 24 hours. It was snowing had this morning when we had to take my wife's Jeep to the shop for new suspension bushings and to out the 4 wheel drive. It quit working two days ago. She made it our of here and into the shop in Carson on the slickest roads we have seen in several years.
Just saw that the 1970 December snow fall record for the Sierras was broken today 193.7"!
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It's been awhile since my last test. Was sick last weekend so needed to recover first.
Last night I cut up some of my cherry tree 🍒 limbs and gave those a try. Burned well and no popping/cracking at all. Then before bed I tried a full cup of pellets. This was way too much. Had a bit of an "overfire" for about a 1/2 hour. 😳
Pipe was glowing mid height and the back of the stove. Temps inside reached 85°. I was sweating and opened the door for a bit.
This was a good test for the fire proofing in the door. Fire died down and all was good.
Woke up this morning warm in the sleeping bag but didn't want to get out to 40° temps.
Well now I know how much pellets it'll take. CO alarm didn't go off. Had the window vented about an inch.
Think im ready for another campout, but not the backyard.
Oh yeah. Bought another fire extinguisher for the trailer and got a squirt bottle of water just incase.
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You are getting it dialed in! Makes me think of a large can of pellets hanging on the wall with a tube to the stove and a string activated valve you could work from bed. Rube Goldberg goes camping. 8)
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Here's a video on how I setup the wood stove when camping.
https://youtu.be/zHYaCZEkzFE
Weather is good here. The urge to camp is strong.
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Nice, Thanks!
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Another winter camping trip. The weather was great mild temps. Explored most of the island and the homestead.
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We had a Case like that when I was a kid. It had been converted to rubber tires. We had several old tractors that had that kind of upgrade. I could not crank it. I see a "little Ford" sitting by it.
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That Ford was small. Especially compared to the big red Case tractor. Tires were as tall as me.
Pretty cool walking through the farm. It told what each person made and the hours were sunrise to sunset, 7 days a week.
Had a bunkhouse for the employees and showers/washroom attached to the side of the house. A "Yellowstone" type TV show could be made about this place.
During winter months there was no leaving the island due to the road being flooded over.
While camping there was a pack of coyotes barking and howling nearby during sunset. They kept thier distance though. :o
Started working on a winter camping video of the last few months using the stove.
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I would like to visit that place. When this country started 85% of the people were farmers, now it is less than 1%. When only 1% of a country knows how to feed themselves things can go bad in a hurry. The US only has two things that Canada & Australia don't have. The first & second amendments, with out the second the first won't last long.
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Last weekend we went back to Antelope island. It was sold out the next 2 months and had that weekend available.
At the gate we upgraded our campsite to one with hookups , it was a new loop not even on the reservation site yet. Very nice site. Fresh paint on the firepit.
Ran the wood stove again but kept the electric heater at about 60° while we slept.
This time we walked down to the water about a mile out. Next morning we were woken up by the pack of coyotes on the hill at 4am then rain a few hours later before leaving for home.
I also found out about another island that has a interesting story .
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Another adventure. That is cool! Tell us the new island story.
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The island is named Fremont island you can access this by a sand bar and drive out there but heavy-duty 4x4 is recommended cause you can get stuck driving across the flats. It has gone through a bunch of owners over the years. Most recently diesel bros acquired it and was trying to build a neighborhood out there. (This would be about the time that they got sued and lost)
After getting denied a right of way permit multiple times from the city to run sewage, power and water lines along this sand bar. It was put up for sale and bought by a local philanthropist who in turn donated it to the state with public access assured .
It was quoted by someone saying "it's good to see the island under responsible ownership" .
The fence was taken down at the entrance that the diesel bros put up. .
I'd like to explore it but getting there is the hard part.
May need another vehicle for recovery. Not many try to drive out there , it's mostly hiking/biking. No overnight camping.
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Interesting, thanks Exactly where is this? There are so many great places I haven't seen yet.
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Just outside of Salt Lake city.
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OK, I googled it. Yes, I bet driving out there could be a mess.
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The great salt lake has been getting some attention politically this year about the low water level ,so that's good.
I'd like to drive out there while I can . Not sure if it would be better later fall (dryer possibly) or mid winter when everything is frozen. Probably too late now, well I have other plans for the next weekend or two.
10 year's ago you could only access this by boat.
Fish and game actually did tour's with their boats.
Before settlers arrived Kit Carson explored this island and carved a cross into a rock that's still there.
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My dad, aunts & uncles carved seats in the sandstone near a waterfall O Ceta Creek in Texas. The church that owns the property now tells everyone they were carved bu Indian Chiefs who held war councils there.
Salt Lake was drying up long before it was called Salt Lake. One of the great examples of climate change that began with the end of the last ice age. It'll be back some day. ::)
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Starting off the winter camping season. The weather was perfect until 3am......
https://youtu.be/kFdBx0D9om0
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Be prepared! How many people RIGHT NOW would like to have that little heater and a bowl of cereal? Your camp trailer could be priceless in the near future.
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This guy got it much worse than I did .
I shoulda done what he did. Point it into the wind.
I was more at a 45° angle to the wind.
https://youtu.be/vHBQnxasmQw
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Quite a Video. He should have kept driving. He was lucky. It's bad enough to watch the news people go out and stand in the wind but they have backup. He could have been in deep doo!